A Conversation with Bernard Deacon: Housing – Keskows gans Bernard Deacon: Annedhyans

Several months ago, two folk from Sordya sat down with academic and Cornish activist Bernard Deacon. If you haven’t read the first part, check it out to hear our discussion on the Cornish leftist magazine An Weryn (The People) which Bernard helped to run.

Our next section is on a hugely important issue for Kernow: housing.

Nans yw misyow, dew dhen a Sordya a gewsis gans akademek ha gweythreser a Gernow Bernard Deacon. Mar ny wruss’ta redya an kynsa rann, mir orto dhe glewes agan keskows a lyver termyn a Gernow An Weryn (An Werin) may hweresas dhe Bernard gans restra.

Agan tregh nessa a doch mater res porres rag Kernow: annedhyans.

Several months ago, two folk from Sordya sat down with academic and Cornish activist Bernard Deacon. If you haven’t read the first part, check it out to hear our discussion on the Cornish leftist magazine An Weryn (The People) which Bernard helped to run.

Our next section is on a hugely important issue for Kernow: housing. In parts to come we discuss direct action and our strategies within the Cornish liberation and language movements. 

A transcription of the audio follows below.

Nans yw misyow, dew dhen a Sordya a gewsis gans akademek ha gweythreser a Gernow Bernard Deacon. Mar ny wruss’ta redya an kynsa rann, mir orto dhe glewes agan keskows a lyver termyn a Gernow An Weryn (An Werin) may hweresas dhe Bernard gans restra.

Agan tregh nessa a doch mater res rag Kernow: annedhyans. Yn rannow a dheu ni a glapp yn kever gwrians didro ha’gan stratejiow y’n movyansow yeth ha rydhheans a Gernow.

Yma treylyans a’n son kevys war-woles.

Sordya Onan: You’ve done a lot of writing about housing and tourism. And I think we’d be interested to know a bit of the trajectory of that over time, because housing and tourism is this thing that we’re still talking about. And what’s your knowledge of that over time? And what does that mean for the movement?

Bernard: Well, for me, tourism is a central factor in Cornish colonisation, effectively. I see tourism as the main driver in Cornwall’s subjugation, if you like. And I suppose I came into Cornish activism, partly aware of the overspill stuff. And I share the views that you were saying about earlier, the previous generation saying, “Well, this is the last of Cornwall”, because we also had those views. We were the last of Cornwall. My parents were the last. I was the last generation who actually went to a Methodist chapel and did those traditionally Cornish things. So there was a feeling… there’s always a feeling that you’re the last generation. And, you know, you’ll probably feel it eventually that you’re the last generation.

Sordya Onan: I feel it sometimes now.

Bernard: Yeah, well… Don’t feel it at your age, no, wait for at least a few decades! But you will do. So we were aware of that. So in that sense, I suppose we were seeing the settlement, the counter-urbanisation that began in the 1960s, as a bit of a shock.

It was a cultural shock, to be honest, and it’s not right wing to say that it was a cultural shock. 

Suddenly we had middle class English turning up in Cornwall. We kind of explained it through the process of colonial settlement. We’re being colonised effectively. There will be no Cornish left. We’ll all be Anglicised. We were all pretty Anglicised anyway, when you think about it, but we were going to be even more Anglicised.

There will be no… Cornwall will be—and I’ve always argued this anyway—a kind of Surrey by the sea, Gentrification, and that’s exactly what’s happened. So we have got this… I’ve written about lifestruggle Cornwall and lifestyle Cornwall. You’ve got lifestyle Cornwall gradually pushing out Cornwall. So the Cornish are in a kind of ghetto, lots of them, of lifestruggle Cornwall. And current policies, current political control of Cornwall is kind of exacerbating that.

It’s not a question of Cornish versus English because… Somebody wrote something… I’d written on—I don’t use it very much these days, can’t stand it—Twitter, or what used to be Twitter… Somebody said, because I said something about population change, and somebody said something about the council, Cornwall Council, and they said, “Oh, if only there were more Cornish on the council”. And I said, “They are Cornish. Cornwall council, most councillors are Cornish. They are ethnically Cornish. Why do you think it’s going to be any better?” It’s not. You know, it’s not a question of Cornish or English, it’s where your ideas are. 

We used to have a phrase in the ‘70s: it’s not where you’re from, it’s… I forget the second part of it. It came from the Bretons anyway, but it sort of summed it up.

So, you know, if there is going to be Cornish freedom or freedom for the Cornish nation, then the nation’s borders can be porous. But there still has to be some recognition that you need to stop this process of colonialism.

Sordya Dew: Yeah, I think now one of the biggest things that is the gateway for a lot of people into Cornish politics, Cornish activism is housing. I first got involved through ACORN down in Falmouth and Penryn, which is the tenants’ union down there. And I think, a lot of people get involved, because it’s sort of a very visible issue. It’s something that people actually can tangibly feel rather than ideological and rhetorical arguments. It’s something that actually is a big part of people’s lives. Was that still the case back when you were organising? Was that a big, or one of the biggest, reasons that people were getting started out and joining things like MK? 

Bernard: No, I don’t think it was. I don’t think housing was then. Because it wasn’t half as bad as it is now. The housing crisis has got progressively worse, which is the irony of it.

You know, huge numbers of houses have been built. Building rate is much higher now than it was back in the ‘70s. And yet we have a bigger housing crisis, which is itself an indictment of “build as many houses as you can and you solve the problem” and it doesn’t solve the problem. All it does is produce profits for mass builders, most of whom are outside Cornwall and make the situation worse, frankly. 

So it’s not what you need: a completely restructured housing structure, housing system, you know. Providing houses through the free market, in the Cornish case, at least does not work. This is the classic case.

Now it wasn’t so bad in the ‘70s. Because, I mean, we didn’t have much income, but we were still able to get a mortgage. I was still able to get a mortgage. Well, I didn’t, my partner did. I didn’t have a job, but my partner got a mortgage on her salary as a nurse. And that was soon after we came back to Cornwall. ‘77, I think.

So you could do it, you know, okay, we bought a house that was only a small terrace house in Redruth. I still live in a small terrace house in Redruth, so I haven’t moved on, but not the same house. But we were able to do it. Nowadays, even that is, I would guess, pretty tricky now with the prices of housing.

Sordya Onan: I wonder, thinking about what you did in the ‘70s and getting mortgages and our housing struggle now, one of the biggest things that’s developed from then till now is neoliberalism. And I wondered if you could talk a little, considering what you’ve said, about the material things like housing and then the political changes. I know you’ve got a thing on Cornish and neoliberalism, but I haven’t read it, so I’m wondering if you could tell us about that bridge of developing neoliberalism till now.

Bernard: Well, neoliberalism has just made it worse, because it destroys the role of the state, local or central. And it’s it through things like Right to Buy and, you know, freeing up housing legislation, freeing up planning.

It’s actually made those processes of speculative housing development much worse. So, neoliberalism—which they were already moving towards in the ‘70s anyway, under Labour, that’s when it begins pre-Thatcher—it’s just a kind of mad ideology that’s exacerbated the colonial situation of Cornwall and the difficulty of Cornish people, especially younger Cornish people who didn’t manage to get on that escalating ladder of housing prices, of getting housing, basically.

Sordya Dew: I was just gonna ask, because you mentioned Right to Buy, how badly did that affect local housing here?

Bernard: Withdrawing a lot of council housing, especially in coastal and rural areas, exactly as predicted, what we predicted at the time. And exactly what happened, because what’s happened? People bought their council houses, they then sell them on, or other people can buy them, and then they become second homes in tourist areas. I mean, we’ve got this huge second home problem, which politicians will pay lip service to, but they don’t do anything very much about it. I mean, I’ve got a mate, I wouldn’t say he’s anything like an anarchist, but he’s very much involved in housing issues. And he just goes on all the time about second homes, to the point of utter boredom. Second homes and holiday lets, you know, how roughly about 12 to 15% of the housing stock are just not lived in permanently now.

So his argument is… Housing, you must understand, housing as projected by the media and by the government, by politicians is not about housing, it’s about capital accumulation. That’s what it’s about. And when Labour go on about “build more houses”, they’re just the party of capital accumulation. And in Cornwall, capital accumulation is all about speculative housing sold to incomers, basically. That’s it, that’s the market. And second homes and the tourist industry. And the tourist industry is there at the centre of this web, creating the demand to move to Cornwall, helping to destroy our environment.

And for me, I mean, we knew about global warming, actually, back when we were doing An Weryn. It’s amazing how long that’s taken to catch on. But, to me, the environmental argument also has kind of converged with the with Cornish nationalism, if you like. And I would take a very strong stance now environmentally on on that, you know, because housing in Cornwall is one of our biggest carbon emitters.

Sordya Onan: Ty a wrug meur a skrifa a annedhyans ha tornyaseth. Ha my a dyb y fia dhe les godhvos an towlhyns a henna dres termyn, drefen bos annedhyans ha tornyaseth neppyth mayth eson hwath ow kesklappya. Pyth yw dha wodhvos a henna dres termyn? Ha pyth yw an styr rag an movyans?

Bernard: Wel, en gwreeanath ma viagorieth an kenza elven en colonieth a Gernow. Me wel viagorieth vel praga brossa a worra Kernow dadn an ew, mar menga. Ha therama soppoga der reeg’ve doaz berra gweithrezeth Kernoack, tabm dreath aganvoas vednans. Therama sengy an gwelow der reega whye laul en avar, an heenath kens a laul “Wel, thew hebma an deweth a Gernow”, rag aweth tho an tobianzow’na genan. Tho nye an dewetha a Gernow. Tho kerens ve an dewetha. Tho ve an heenath dewetha d’reeg moaz tha chapel Methodieth ha geel an tacklow Kernoack henco’na. Endella, ma pubprez omglowans vetho whye an heenath dewetha. Ha car drevol whye vedn e omglowas wartewa tel o whye an heenath dewetha.

Sordya Onan: My a’n klew lemmyn.

Bernard: Ea, wel… na rewh e omglowas ort agos oodg, na, gortero nebbaz degvlethan, tha’n liha! Saw, whye vedn. Na whath, nye oya hedna. Etho, e’n sens’na, car drevol them nye tha wellaz an trevesigeth, an gordrevageth, ter reeg dalla et an 1960ow, vel tabm jagg.

Tho va jagg cultural, en weer, ha nag ew a thehow pelha tha laul tel o jagg cultural.

Thesempias, thera nye kwellas Sowzon an class crez a toaz tha Gernow. Tho stirriez genan dreath process an trevesigeth coloniack, en seer, coloniethez a vee nye. Na veth Kernowion gerrez. Nye oll veth Sowznackhez. En weer, tho nye oll por Sowznackhez penag vo, pa rew whye predery dro thotha, saw nye veea whath moy Sowznackhez.

Na veth… Kernow veth—ha pubdeth thew hebma dathla kenkia gennam penag vo—zort a Surrey reb an mor. Gentilieth, ha thew hedna an peth poran a reeg skidnia. Della, ma tha nye… ma screffez gennam dro tha Gernow giz omdowl ha Kernow giz bownas. Ma Kernow giz bownas en siger pockia meaz Kernow. Della, ma’n Kernowion en getto giz omdowl, mear anothans. Ha ma policys an dethiow’ma, rowl bolitiack a Gernow aweth, e weel lacka ha lacka.

Nag ew qwestion Kernowion bedn an Sowzon rag… Nebonen screffaz neppeth… tho screffez gennam—na rama e ewzia mear an dethiow’ma, thew hager—Twitter, po an peth o Twitter… Nebonen lavarraz, drefen me tha laul neppeth dro tha draylians poblans, ha nebonen lavarraz neppeth dro tha’n Cussel, Cussel Kernow, ha’ngye lavarraz “Ah, mar peea moy a Gernowion et an cussel”. Me worrebaz, “Thenz Kernowion. Cussel Kernow, thew brossa radn a gusselorion Kernoack. Thenz Kernoack genegack. Rag fra esta perdery veth e gwell?” Na veth. Whye ore, nag ew qwestion boaz Kernoack po Sowznack, thew pelea igge goz tibianzow.

Thera lavar tha nye et an 70ow: nag ew an lea a resta doaz, thew… Nakevys an nessa rann. E theath athor an deez Breten Vean, penag vo, saw, cot derivas da o.

Della, whye ore, mar peth franketh Kernoack po franketh rag an nacyon Kernoack, nenna emblow an nacyon ell boaz boll. Saw, whath e raze boaz neb adgan dr’ez othom cessia an process’ma a golonialeth.

Sordya Dew: Ea, my a dyb bos lemmyn onan a’n brassa rann hag yw an porth rag meur a dus yn politegieth Kernow, gweythresieth Kernow, yw annedhyans. My a gemeras rann yn kynsa der ACORN yn Aberfal ha Penryn, hag yw unyans an wobrenoryon ena. Ha dell dybav meur a dus a gemmer rann drefen y vos mater pur weladow. Dhe wir yth yw neppyth a yll tus omglewes yn tavadow a-der argyansow ideologyl hag arethek. Yth yw neppyth hag yw dhe wir rann vras a vewnansow tus. O henna hwath an kas pan eses ta ow restra? O henna acheson bras, po onan a’n brassa achesonys, rag tus dhe dhalleth ha junya taklow kepar hag MK?

Bernard: Na rama perdery. Na rama perdery dr’o annethians thanna. Drefen nag o mar throag vel ew lebmen. Ma’n gorothom a dreven devethez tabm ha tabm lacka, hag ew an peth ironack.

Niver hugez a dreven vee derevelez. Thew an gevrath derevel euhella mear lebmen tel era et an 70ow. Ha stella, ma tha nye gorothom annethians brossa, ha thew hedna keyson a’n lavar “gwrew derevel mar leeaz chye der ellowhye hag owna an problem” ha nag igge va owna an problem. Ma oll dr’igge va keel tha waynia moy les rag draffers bilders a vear a dreven, an brossa radn anothans acarr ha geel tha’n cas gwetha, en weer.

Nag ew hedna an peth ew raze tha nye: roath an annethians, composter derevel treven, dasshappiez pedn ha trooz, flam noweth, whye ore. Nag ew da derevel treven dreath an varras ryth, tha’n leha en Kernow. Otubma an cas classick.

Nag o mar throag et an 70ow. Rag, therama menia, nag era mear a vona than, saw tho possibel whath cawaz morgaga. Me olga whath cawaz morgaga. Wel, na reegave, cowethes’ve. Nag era wheal gennam, saw cawaz morgaga reeg a howethes gen e gober hye vel clavjores. Ha tho hedna teken ber ouga doaz trea tha Gernow. ’77, me dib.

Della, whye olga e weel, whye ore, da lower, nye bernaz chy tel o chy vean rew en Redruth. Stella therama tregaz en chy vean rew en Redruth, etho nag ez gwayez aman gennam, buz nag ew an keth chy. Saw nye olga e weel. An dethiow’ma, ken vee hedna, me venga desmiggia, por gales lebmen gen priziow an treven mar euhall.

Sordya Onan: Ow tybi a’n pyth a wrusses y’n ‘70ow, kavos marwostlow ha’gan strif annedhyans lemmyn, onan a’n taklow brassa a dhisplegyas bys y’n eur ma yw nowlivrelieth. My a omwovyn mar kalses kewsel tamm, yn unn gonsidra an pyth a leversys, a-dro dhe daklow materyel kepar hag annedhyans ha’n chanjyow politek. My a wor bos dhis neppyth a Gernewek ha nowlivrelieth, mes ny’n redis, ytho martesen ty a alsa derivas orthyn a-dro dhe nowlivrelieth ow tisplegya bys y’n eur ma.

Bernard: Ea, wel, thew gwrez lacka gen neolibraleth, rag ma’va destria part an stat, a’n costys po’n creaz. Ha dreath tacklow pocarra Right to Buy ha, whye ore, lowsel lahes annethians, lowsel menistrasyon an teer.

En greeanath, e wraze an process’ma a therevel treven aventurus lacka fest. Della, neolibraleth—ha’ngye kenz lebmen gwaya tua va et an ‘70ow, penag vo, en dadn governans Party an Lavur, tho hedna termen reeg e thalla kenz Thatcher—thewa zort a gregans politack frantik der reeg gwethhea an cas coloniack a Gernow ha caletter an bobel Gernoack, en enwedgack pobel Gernoack younka na olga crambla war’n skeal assendia a brisiow treven, tha gawaz treven, antye.

Sordya Dew: My a vynnsa govyn, drefen ty dhe veneges Gwir a Brena, py mar dhrog o an effeyth war annedhyans leel omma?

Bernard: Tedna meaz mear a dreven an cussel, en enwedgack dro tha’n qwartrys reb an moar hag a’n meaz, poran vel reega nye raglaul ort an termen’na. Ha poran an peth reeg skidnia, rag pand’reeg skidnia? Teez a bernaz go threven an cussel, nenna angye go gwerraz, po teez orol go ferna, ha nenna mownz second treven e’n areas touriasack. Meero, ma’n problem hugez second treven gennan, ha dro thotha dr’igge teez politack  gweel weez, saw nag igge angye geel terveth mear dro thotha. Ma cothman them, na vengama laul drewa anarkiack, buz mear a leaz gans ev dro tha’n materiow treven. Ha ma’va por droublez dro tha second treven, tha’n point skeethder. Second treven ha treven degoliow gobernez, whye ore, fattel ew dro tha 12 tha 15 a ganz a’gon creen treven gwag lebmen.

Della, thew e genkians… Treven, whye raze onderstondia, treven gen gerriow an mainys ha’n governans, gen politegorion, nag ew dro tha dreven, thew dro tha gorra en bern capital. Thew hedna an peth ewa. Ha pe’ra Lavur clappia dro tha “therevel moy a dreven”, nag enz bez party cressians an capital. Hag en Kernow, thew cressians capital oll adro treven aventurus gwerrez tha deez oncoth, hep mar. Thew hedna an dra, an varras ewa. Ha second treven ha’n diwisians viagorieth. Ha mownz diwisians touristiack ena, ort creaz an gwias’ma, creatia an demond gwaya tha Gernow, gwerrez tha thestria gon kerhidneth.

Ha ragoma, nye oya dro tha dobmans an beaz, en gweer etta, termen nye tha weel An Weryn. Thew marthys pez blethan aban hedna kenz teez orol convethes. Saw, them, ma’n kenkians kerhidneth kezunia gen an – gen nacyonieth Kernoack, mar mednowhye. Ha me venga degemeres stowns por greav lebmen dro tha’n kerhidneth, whye ore, drefen boaz annethians en Kernow wonen gon dillorion carbon an brossa.

Sordya

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